This image is a caricature by Red Elk that he sent to The SPECTRUM in a letter.

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Red Elk’s Medicine Message Of Worlds Within Worlds: Old Mysteries, Powerful Truths For Today

Red Elk interview continued:

Red Elk:  Some are very natural.  Some, very few, but some were made by Lucifer as he dug in through our surface to find the heat-range he liked.

And then again, some of them are on the number 5, and number 4 planetary levels [beneath the Earth’s surface, the surface being number 6 ].  Now, understand, when I speak of number 5 and number 4, and on down, I’m speaking of solid earth with caves.  All right?

They were made by the so-called gods, who originally came down to DNA us.  That was two alliances.  One, we call the Slopeheads, they were giants, 20-26 feet tall giants, who were in alliance with the ones who we call the Lizard people.  They made an alliance to come to this planet to mine gold, and other minerals.

The Lizards, liking it hot, because they are from a series of three planets that are nothing but sand—three dwarf suns that are so hot it would blind them within a minute.  They dug down.  They, literally, live underground, in beautiful (to them) cities and towns, connected by tunnels and stuff, but underground on those planets.

They were not comfortable up here on the # 6 level of Earth’s surface—too cold, too windy.  It was just not their comfort zone.

So they said: “Look, we’ll take part of those [ primitive ] humans of this planet, and we’ll go underground and we’ll just mine x number of miles below.  You’re used to this up here, you take x amount [of primitive humans for slave labor], and you do it up here.”  And that’s how the alliance was made.

The alliance also said that there would be a people untouched by either, to evolve naturally.  That has happened, and that’s our Sasquatch, Yeti, Bigfoot, and so forth.

Nevertheless, the Lizards were, and are, extremely cruel taskmasters.  For whatever reason, I have never seen a female Lizard from below, in my taking past trips or present. 

Rick Martin:  Yes, I read that in your booklet, pretty interesting.

Red Elk:  So what has happened is, they took their quota of human beings, took them digging tunnels and stuff, going down, took them in to be miners.

And, in so doing, they’re quite the sex fiends, these beings, very sex-minded.  They raped men and women alike.  Now, these are male Lizards rapeing whoever they wanted.

And, these Lizards hardly ever got their slave people any more then absolutely needed, for drink, let alone food.  They were really bad slave masters, and killing these people off, prematurely, just through their own cruelty.  And, therefore, running out of their quota. 

So, they started going up, sneaking up here, and grabbing more people to take down there. 

Meanwhile, our “gods” up here (not the true God, understand), they were much more pleasant, much kinder.  They used shots and stuff for their DNA, to make our Sasquatch more handleable, and more to their need and liking, to do the mining up here.  So, they weren’t rapists, and stuff.

They were pretty good people, really, to be honest with you, despite the agenda.  By the way, those people are the ones who, the Slopeheads, are literally sculpted and are the heads that are on Easter Island.

Nevertheless, there were a number of raids, and it was inexcusable.  The Lizards had broken the alliance many times, and were raiding the “no one touches these” group, as well as taking some of our so-called gods, down. 

So, our gods decided: “This is enough.  Let’s face it.  These Lizard people have done nothing but lie.  And they’ve broken the alliance many, many times over.  So, let’s just declare war, and say enough’s enough.  Let’s go down and save those human beings that they’ve got down there, and pull them out, and try and destroy the Lizards, and get them out of there, and get them off the inner-land.” 

Well, in so doing they realized that this surface, the Sun, was way too bright.  There were winds, and stuff like that.  These people have been down there, and bred, and so on and so forth, for many, many, many, many years.  They were not used to sunlight.  They were not used to cold.  They were just slaves, digging, and being raped, and eaten alive—anything that these Lizard s.o.b.s wanted to do, they did. 

So, our boys, our gods, went down to the next level, making more tunnels on the way down, and connected, tunneled between giant caverns.  And in those caverns they created what we have on this planet, but with a much dimmer Sun.

Actually, I did a misdeed, by accident.  I’ve never seen a Moon under there.  The Sun is the Moon.  At night, it gets darker; in day, it gets lighter.  It’s a fascinating machine, this hovering Sun.  And it’s not just in one cavern, it’s in all these huge caverns, they’ve got this. 

Rick Martin:  Now, I don’t want to get you off-track.  I want to stay on this track.  But I want to remember to ask you about the being that [Zulu Shaman and Elder] Credo Mutwa referred to as Jabulon, the leader of the Chitauli, or the Reptilians.  Is THAT Lucifer, is that one and the same?

Red Elk:  No, no, no.

Rick Martin:  Totally different?

Red Elk:  Well, yeah.  He thinks he’s Top Dog, because he is just like them, all thinking they are god, they are Lucifer.  He just thinks he is the Top Dog amongst them.  But he himself is being used by Lucifer, who is FULL OF STEALTH. 

But anyway, this Sun, again, in reality, is quite small, being that it’s only two or three miles up.  It pulls energy.  I looked at it just within the last, oh, three, four weeks, trying to figure out what kind of power it has.  It’s not nuclear power, and yet it’s forever lasting.  The gravity situation, to make it levitate, I have no idea.  But, I have found out that it pulls power in from our actual Sun, through the Earth’s skin and pores.

Rick Martin:  Boy, that’s interesting.

Red Elk:  Yeah, it is really fascinating. 

I am connecting this discussion with certain Earth-healing vortices, and with a number of pyramids here in the United States, and the time cave.

There are certain places you don’t dare walk onto, walk directly onto the top, or be in, with a credit card, or anything.  Literally, the power is so great, that energy going in, and back, and mixing, to power the Sun that is within that general area of the time cave, or pyramid, or whatever, it just wipes out your magnetic strip.  It does the same thing with cell phones.  New batteries, I mean NEW, within an hour of putting it in, you turn the battery on, within under 10 minutes, your battery is drained.  It burns film, when you go to take pictures.  Your film comes out just with this orange/red coloration, like it’s been exposed to great heat.  You just can’t get good pictures from these spots.  You can get good pictures OF these spots, but not from these spots.  But that’s because the gods, with whatever type of magic—I call it magic, not meaning that, but—technology they use, have learned to harness our own Sun’s solar power to power these false suns. 

Once all of this environment was made, the plains were planted, and the grasses growing, they built beautiful cities, oh, just beautiful!  The main building of each city is a cross between the Aztec pyramid and the Giza pyramid.  Just beautiful, all stone.  The ones that I’ve been to, if it’s granite, it’s a white granite.  Sandstone is involved, and another kind.  There is a black city, too, all black, like a black obsidian, just absolutely gorgeous.  It doesn’t mean that it’s a bad city; that’s the rock that was there that they could work with.  And there’s another city, down under Mexico—actually, if I can remember correctly, under Mexico City—and it’s just beautiful!  And it’s much more Aztecian—a gold, gold-covered, beautiful thing.  And these are all over on this # 5 level of the Inner Earth, just beneath us. 

Anyway, once they got everything growing, you know, they had plants growing, they planted fish in the water, and so on, and so forth.

Rick Martin:  Who are we talking about?

Red Elk:  Our gods, up here, preparing to save those who have been taken below.  How they got away with it, without the Lizards knowing, beats me, but they did.

They got all this going, all this built.  Once that was done, they started drilling down to the next lower level, # 4, and making tunnels.  And in so doing, they also set-up many traps between our surface and the ceiling, and the cavern sides, that hold up the caves.  They made many, many tunnels, many side tunnels, all traps, all traps.  And the only ones who knew where these traps were, were the builders themselves, our so-called gods. 

Well, they went down and attacked the Lizards, and did like I told Mr. Art.  They did an excellent number on them.  Many, on both sides, were killed, including human slaves; many were killed.  A huge war went on down there.  And the Lizards were beat.  And they ran off and licked their wounds.

We got what we could—I say we, meaning our gods—we got what we could and brought them up to the surface of # 5 level [ first level below Earth’s surface], to let them stay 10 generations; however long those “generations” were, I do not know.  It was far longer than what you and I call a generation now.

This was so they could get used to that sun, and what little breeze they created, through many tunnels that they built, and so on, so that they could safely come up to the surface, the #6 level, and face an even stronger Sun, and stronger breeze, and so on. 

Well, the Lizards, over time, licked their wounds and regrouped, and attacked.  And our people, our gods, were hoping they could make it through 10 generations.

Well, they didn’t.  They made it through about 8½, I think, before the Lizards counter-attacked, driving our human people, as well as our gods, up to this #6 surface.  Your Navajo, Arapaho, so on, they are really the miners from down there—short stocky bodies, strong legs, strong arms.  They have yet to evolve into a more typical # 6 surface dweller [the Earth’s surface upon which we live]; but they’re doing good though. 

Rick Martin:  So when they talk about coming up through the Sipapu, and coming up from the Earth—

Red Elk:  They know what they’re talking about!  Listen to them. 

And they [the Native Americans] are not the only ones.  Others have come up, in Africa, and all different continents.  Some of our Africans claim they came from above, now, and that’s true.  Some claim they came from below, up, and that’s true.  Some of them don’t know where they came from, and that’s true, because they were created and always stayed here on # 6 level. 

Meanwhile, the Lizards themselves made many tunnels, not only through the drilling process, but preparing to counter-attack. 

Rick Martin:  Now, were the Lizards independents?  Or, were they just associates of Lucifer?

Red Elk:  They didn’t know Lucifer existed.  Do you understand that?  Get that in your head.

Rick Martin:  Totally independent.

Red Elk:  Totally believing they are god.  They can do anything they want, godly or ungodly.  They don’t even have a name for God, or a name for Lucifer.  They have their own name.  They are ALL—so they think—just a big con job.  But nevertheless, they, in preparing to attack the # 5 level, also made tunnels, with many traps. 

So the great chase was on.  They came up and attacked “our” guys on # 5, who were watching the kids grow (the rescued ones, for the 10 generations), and they did a number on our guys. 

So, our guys escaped with a number of the human beings who they had rescued; many, many others never made it.  They were all killed.  And they emerged, through certain areas across our continents, and that’s where the stories “we came from Inner Earth” came from.  They did! 

What happened to our gods, our Slopeheads?  It really is something I don’t know.

I know that the Lizards have remained.  But the gods, basically, have left.  And by the way, I think I’ve got a rather good idea what they did.  They went to the dimension that was not in our dimension, where this Earth is.  They were from another dimension, and they went home. 

Rick Martin:  Let’s continue to talk about the layers.  I know you got so side-tracked on Art Bell.  If you have more to say about the layers under our feet, let’s do that now.

Red Elk:  I don’t think there is much more to say about it.  They are not “balls within balls”.  They are all connected.

The lower you go, the less and less caves, until they are almost totally non-existent.  And that’s where Lucifer has taken over and made what I like to call their “glass wall”—caves and tunnels and stuff—quite a machinery that they work with.  This is kind-of odd to say that because the Christian world thinking we’re dealing with all spirit.  Well, yes and no.  They’ve learned to appear in spirit.  I do that.  But, nevertheless, they are very technical, physical-technical, and they have forever life. 

Rick Martin:  How would you describe Lucifer, if you were to do that?

Red Elk:  Looks?

Rick Martin:  Yes.

Red Elk: Oh—beautiful, absolutely beautiful.

Rick Martin:  Human?

Red Elk:  No, angel; human-looking, but an angel.  Not demonic, and to be honest with you—no hair on his body, none; no sexual organs, none; there’s nothing there.  He’s got the perfect body, the PERFECT body—tonal muscles, stomach, just perfect; the guy is perfect.  Yet so “black” [spiritually dark] that in the black where I was facing him, I literally hit my nose with my hand, trying to see if I could see my hand.  And yet, when he appeared in that blackness, it was like there was a dim light on; no problem to see.  And so unbelievably beautiful you couldn’t believe it.  But, he’s like someone who is so charismatic, so well liked, who comes to a party, the kind of man or woman who, when he/she opens the door and enters, everybody’s head turns.  You understand?

Rick Martin:  Yes, I do.

Red Elk:  And that one person, man or woman, looks over the party of these people and sees somebody who they can’t stand, and their face instantly turns to this HATE.  There is hate on the face of Lucifer.  Absolutely beautiful, but the most ugly thing that you can imagine. 

Rick Martin:  A large being?

Red Elk:  Oh yeah, about 22 feet.  No tail, no horns, no eyebrows, no pointy ears.  Beautiful being.  Absolutely—it’s hard for me to say this, being male—gorgeous. 

Rick Martin:  This will seem like a sidetrack, but I have a note here to myself to ask you about Planet X or Nibiru.  Who are those beings, the Anunnaki?

Red Elk:  You know, I don’t know who the Anunnaki are.  I have a very strong feeling—although I cannot say I know—but I have a very strong feeling they are a race of beings, slaves, who were brought here by another race, not of the two of the Alliance, from another planet.  And were themselves used, on this planet, in a slave form.  But they, very definitely, are not of this planet.  Where they went, I know not, other than taken-off and taken to wherever, to another planet.  Kind-of traveling slaves. 

Now, Planet X, I’m not sure what you’re referring to.  Are you referring to the one that makes the great oval, that comes by every 2300 or 3200 years, or something.

Rick Martin:  Yes, every 3600 years. 

Red Elk:  Oh, yes, and it’s here, it’s here.  It’s within their ships’ range, and has been now for, at the very least, three years, five, I think.  These are the Gargoyle race.  This is where our Gargoyle legends come from, our devils.  That’s these beings.

They don’t have the technology—they don’t have the need, really—to go through worm holes, or whatnot, to get to one place or another.  They are on their own spaceship, a planet, that makes a great oval course.  And they harvest the planets as they go by.  WE are the harvest, the human beings.  And they pluck us like you and I would go out and pluck apples off a tree.  But they always leave enough people to re-seed the Earth.

Rick Martin:  Well, talking about the harvest, let’s talk about the False Rapture vs. the Real Rapture. 

Red Elk:  Ok.  Now, this is going to be really hard for the so-called Christian world to comprehend, unless they’ve got some dang brains. 

Rick Martin:  That’s fine.  Just speak truthfully, that’s all we care about.

Red Elk:  That’s right.  I want them to check it out for themselves.  Scripture says—this is God saying—“I am the same today, yesterday, and tomorrow.”  And that’s His Word.  He does not lie.

So, He IS the same today, yesterday, and tomorrow.  He will not change.  And people have often said, look at the Jews in the Old Testament, that they are examples, if you follow God, what will happen; if you get out of His step, what will happen.  See, the city did that, and they got attacked by that city, and blah, blah, blah, and they leave it go there.

But the Old Testament not only was using that as an example for people 3, 4, 5 hundred years later to look back on, it was there for today to look back on.  Take Nineveh for example.  God told Jonas: “You go there and tell them I’m going to destroy them in three days.” 

And Jonas didn’t want to.  They were the Lizards of the day.  They were pretty bad guys.  Not real Lizards, but pretty bad people.  And he didn’t want to.  He defied God and ended up in a serpent’s belly, whether it was a giant guppy, a whale, or whatnot, never mind.  Why people say a whale, when the Bible doesn’t say that at all, I don’t know.  It’s an example of starting false rumors. 

But, anyway, he ended up there, spit out on the shore in front of the city of Nineveh, and decided, you know: “I’ve been living a rough life trying to run from God; I better do what He told me.”

So, he went into the city, and danged if they did not repent!  Turn away from sin—that’s the word repent.  That’s what it means.  And that really ticked-off Jonas, and he went up on the hillside and pouted.  He wanted them to get theirs. 

Now, God did not destroy them in 3 days.  He said He was going to.  And yet, because they turned their hearts back to their Creator, He would not destroy them.  They got destroyed, just like He said, but it was left to their children, who walked away.  Nineveh was an example, for the people, if you do what God tells you, everything will be cake and honey; if not, you’ve got trouble. 

So, people have looked at that and used that as an example.  But, not thinking at all that it is we who are NOW Nineveh, the planet Earth!  And if we turn away from sin, if we repent, i.e., if we turn away from sin and go back to God, then we, the planet Earth and all people on it, will forego Armageddon at this time.  It will be put off for our children, or our children’s children—whoever decides to slide back in, as a world generation, to go their own way.

Just as Nineveh, the city of the Old Testament, repented and was saved, so too can this world repent and be saved.  We, Earth, is Nineveh, now.

“I am the same yesterday, today, and tomorrow.”

And in that, He warned the Jews, if you do what I tell you to do, if you do this, this, and this, everything will be cake and honey.  But, if you do this, this, and this, then you will be taken into captivity, and those who captured them could do with them as they chose.

That always happened.  The Jews never really paid too much attention.  In time, they all slop-shoot down the hill.  Then, next thing you know, they’ve got armies attacking them.

And then they start crying “Oh God!”

And He says “Too late dude, you know.”

Like you grabbing a little kid who you’ve warned and warned and warned.  Finally, it comes to it, and she or he are screaming, as you’re getting ready to put them over your knee.

“I’m sorry, I’m sorry.”  Too late. 

So what happened?  He was always, and will always, and is always a being of His own Word.  He does not lie!

What the future holds is, this planet, under the guise of Nineveh, will have to go through all kinds of spankings, because we paid no attention.  But, in the Old Testament there were many lands that captives could be taken to—always leaving a remnant of Jews in Jerusalem, by the way, a very small remnant.  But, nevertheless, He was true to His Word.  And they were taken into captivity. 

Today, we have no single country which is not as good, or better, or as bad, or worse, than any other country.  We will be taken into captivity, except it will not be of this land.  It will be onto other planets, other lands; other beings will be the bad guys.  Other beings from other planets will be the bad guys who come to us and take us off.  THE FIRST RAPTURE IS FALSE! 

All these towers put up across our country, and I imagine other countries, are not just for microwaves—they’re for mind control, mass mind control!  As well, there are some super-duper towers that can instill in us such thoughts as: “Oh, Christ is coming, Christ is coming!”—the joy, and everything else.  And people will run out of their houses, stop their cars, get outside, climb their rooftops, do everything that the Bible says—emotionally controlled through these damned towers.

And then the cargo ships will take them up, physically.  People will see them rising into the heavens—yelling “Hallelujah!”—into captivity, into slavery, sex toys, and alive-eaten food.  I’m not talking all of the masses; I’m talking about those who should be the salt of the Earth, the so-called Christian believers.  The vast majority of Christian believers will die up there! 

Most of those left behind are those who cannot get outside—in the hospitals, and Christians who are in prisons, or down digging mines, whatever; they can’t get up there in time for this Rapture.  They will be the remnant left behind, and in so doing, they will have, maybe, even a harder life than the slaves taken up, because we will be hunted, if we are down here.  Bounties will be on our heads.  They will take a gutted Christian body, and tie it across the hood of a car, running through town with the horn blaring: “Look what I got!  I got my ‘deer’!”—paid for by bounty.  I’m not saying that going up is going to be easy, but I am saying that staying down here isn’t going to be any easier. 

Again: “I am the same today, yesterday, and tomorrow.  I do not lie.”

What the Christians are doing are changing, or not reading, what the Scriptures actually say.  They don’t see two Raptures.  They got their dang butts up in the air, making smiley faces: they’re gonna’ get their rears saved.  Ah, yes, they sure are!

But, we all have to die, don’t we? 

If they would simply read Scriptures, they would find out what Red Elk is saying is totally true.  If they want to change the Scriptures, then what they have to say, want to believe in, that’s their path.

But I’m not changing Scriptures.  I’m telling you what the Scriptures actually say.  Check it for yourself.  Don’t be so dang lazy, so dang stupid, that you take your denomination’s ideas—that are false in many cases, or lax in many more cases—and just accept them as true.  You’re accepting a MAN’S teaching, a man’s interpretation! 

Believe me, the Creator can speak for Himself, and needs no interpretation.  All He needs is somebody who’s got guts enough to sit down, disregard what they have absorbed over the years, and read it for themselves.  He’ll talk to them, if they’re honest about it.

Rick Martin:  I have had the overwhelming feeling that there is something coming up of great magnitude, and that at some point there will be a separation of some kind.  In feeling that, or in thinking that, am I perceiving this False Rapture as the initial separation?

Red Elk:  You could be, and you might not be, because I don’t know what time frame you are sensing.

Rick Martin:  I’m sensing something major happening within the next brief time.  Some kind of major event.

Red Elk:  Let me tell you this:  I doubt that what you’ve just asked is it; I really doubt it. 

Number one: there is going to—right now, starting with this magazine and a few things that have gone on—there is going to be a tremendous “tearing away” from the churches, any denomination, including the religions of the world.

There will be some who finally “get it”, and the rest who want to live in tradition.  There will be a great shifting, a great ripping-way of purity from taintedness.

Most people love their taintedness.  If the beliefs are good enough for their mom and dad, and grandma and grandpa, it’s good enough for them.

But there is a great hunger out there today—and boy, am I a witness to that with these letters!  [He’s referring to the avalanche of mail after his session on the Art Bell program.]  There’s a great hunger to know what real truth is.  And I get this hunger from every kind of people you can imagine—atheists, voodooists, Buddhists, Christians, Muslims, wiccans—all different kinds of believers.  There are none totally satisfied with what they hope is the truth.  They feel there is more truth than what they are learning and receiving—and indeed, that’s true. 

You know, the word salvation—the Christians have got it right and wrong.  Salvation: they believe that by asking the Pale One, Christ, into their life, they will be saved.  This is true, but it’s not the total truth.

Salvation starts the minute—if you’re serious, understand, not just trying to save your rear, but serious—salvation starts the instant Christ comes into you.  Salvation, although you will not find it in a concordance [reference book of biblical passages], to my knowledge, you won’t find it in the Bible, I know that, but you will find it true in your own heart.

Salvation starts instantly.  And the word in your own heart, if you’re serious about seeking salvation, seeking help, you will find that the word salvation means the ability to be a free thinker. 

Christ said: “I’ve come to give life, and give it abundantly.”  Most people think abundance means money.  And this is a falsehood.

Gail Cortright:  Right.

Red Elk:  I am pretty broke.  And yet, I have an abundant life.  I get to talk WITH horses, with trees, with people, with planetary people from other places.  I am rich in spirit.  And yet, I am so poor because there’s got to be a lot more than I know.  My gosh, I’ve got just over $2 in my pocket, and yes, I’d like to have over $2,000 in my pocket, but nevertheless, that doesn’t stop me from going out and seeing God in all things, and being aware that all things are aware of One Creator.  And getting to share my love of Him, with their love of Him, be it a limb, a leaf, a raindrop, whatever. 

And boy, you talk about abundant life!  You people are stuck running around talking to each other, and there’s a lot more out there with a lot more love than another man or woman, believe me.

Gail Cortright:  Yeah, that’s for sure.

Red Elk:  It’s very limited.

Rick Martin:  Yes.  Well, I think that is one of the main problems of the so-called Christian community—limited thinking. 

Red Elk:  The main problem with the community called human beings of Earth is that!  Don’t limit it to Christians, alone.

It is ALL, including ourselves, you, you, and I.  The world of “cans” and the world of “can’ts”.  If you can’t do something—the word can’t, is it negative or positive?  Is it a negative word or a positive word?

Rick Martin:  It’s a negative word. 

Red Elk:  It is not.  It is a positive.  You are positive.

Rick Martin:  You are positive that you can’t do it.  (Laughter)

Red Elk:  You understand?  There is no negative.  And when you can turn that positive can’t, to a positive can, as we in medicine have learned, you will be able to levitate and go downtown with no gas.  You will be able to shut your eyes, envision where you want to go—safely, if you’ve got half a brain; first check where you want to go and make sure it’s safe to go there—and teleport yourself.

This is all in Scriptures.  One person teleported; it is in Scriptures.  Christ walked on water?  NO!  He actually flew on the water.  This is all in Scriptures.  “The things I’ve done, you can do also, even moreso, for I am with you.”  Peter got out of the boat and walked on the water, too—until he realized that was a can’t.

Rick Martin:  (Laughter)

Red Elk:  You understand what I mean?

Rick Martin:  Yes, I do.

Red Elk:  We have such great abilities!  We are limited to only three things; human kind, on any planet, are limited to only three things: (1) We cannot be the Creator, i.e. God, but we can be Godly; (2) we cannot be Lucifer—and a misnomer for him is Satan.  You say that, and you mean Lucifer; it’s not true.

Rick Martin:  Satan is a different being, isn’t he?

Red Elk:  Right, he’s the number-two man.  But when you say Satan, you’re thinking Lucifer, automatically.

(2) You cannot be Satan, but you can be satanic; (3) you cannot be Christ, but you can be Christ-like. 

Anything beyond those three that you cannot be, YOU CAN DO!  I teach this.  And I demonstrate it, at times.

Just this last week I was talking about invisibility—as I became almost totally invisible to the two I was teaching.  They could see right through me, the chair I was sitting in.  I didn’t want to go all the way.  I gave them enough to let them know that I know what I’m talking about.

Gail Cortright:  (Laughter)

Red Elk:  I’ve had people come from, well, one from Florida, two from Texas, one coming from Alaska, and many within driving range.  I’ve taught them how to actually go into a tree, and afterwards, go and speak WITH trees, bushes, plants—speak with, not to.  And they were amazed.  Some came back crying.

All came back just awed, that the stiff wooden tree they call alive is not a piece of wood, but a thinking being, that takes steps slowly, over the centuries; sends up shoots, or sends a part of itself through a seed in a bird’s belly.  And as it dies—not the bird, but the tree—a few feet, or inches, or a mile down the road, it grows.  They take steps.  These are people, tree people, bug people, horse people, four-legged people, feathered people, cloud people, mountain people.

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